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How to Become a Successful Architect - 10 Design CEO Sabrina Klor – Transcript
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- Sabrina Klor explains that without a successful well-run business, there is no design to do in architecture practices.
- Sabrina Klor emphasizes that data is powerful for architecture businesses because it helps make better decisions and prevent problems.
- Sabrina Klor serves as the chair of Women in Architecture UK to advocate for a fairer, more diverse, and equitable profession.
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Without a successful well-run business, there is no design to do. Probably the biggest mistake that the architectural practices in general are doing. >> Your practice employs a number of young architects coming through. What do you think their career paths will be like?
>> This is the conversation that every single business has. >> You're leading more than 400 architects. Let's talk about what it actually takes. >> How much time do we have? >> >> Um >> Sabrina Claw is an architect and the CEO of 10 Design, a practice that in just 15 years has grown from a Hong Kong studio into a 400-person global architecture firm spanning nine international
studios. Our conversation isn't simply about scale or growth. It's an analysis into the leadership in architecture at a moment where the profession is being forced to rethink how we build culture, hold onto creativity, and the way that practices actually operate. Importantly, alongside her role as CEO, Sabrina is also the chair of Women in Architecture UK, a group supporting and advocating for systemic change and greater representation across the built
environment. In this episode, we explore what it really means to grow and thrive in leadership from culture and creativity to personal growth, leaning into your own talents and paving the way to improve the profession for the next generation. Sabrina, thank you so much for joining me.
>> Thank you for having me today. >> You're leading a practice of more than 400 architects over nine studios, multiple countries. Tell me about the weight of that responsibility.
>> That's a good question. You can't avoid the weight, right? But I don't I don't feel the weight in a way that it feels heavy. >> Mhm. >> It's probably the same way I tackle any big problem. I divide it in smaller problems. And it's not that leading a business this size is a problem, but the way I think of it is a collection of nine different studios.
And I see it as a collection of parts that work together really really well to form a really successful part. So, each of our studios have its own leadership, its own client base, its own culture, and and it's it's all about for me making sure that those units I call them self-sustain. Right? So, it's all about those units being self-sustained
in their in their own so that that when you put the the the parts together work we have a much stronger business. It's important for me to be surrounded by really strong leadership.
And and that that that strong leadership has agency >> Sure. >> to to be able to make the right decisions on their own. And so, I don't see myself leading alone. I always go with a team. I'm I'm a huge team player. So, that's probably I don't feel that weight in my in my shoulders that you you probably suggest.
I actually really enjoy it. Uh I enjoy the complexity. I enjoy the different cultures and and and also the the huge opportunities that come >> Mhm. >> with being uh widely spread and and complex which which are uh which are quite a few that makes us much more resilient as a business that we can pivot from, you know, markets that are not performing
well, for example, and um and also allow us to put the right skills for projects that are coming in all the time and pick and choose. And so, it makes us as a a better a better business uh but but again for me start from making sure each of the parts are running properly.
>> I think it's a fascinating thing and something we'll come on to is the sort of scale and complexity of that thing. But from a from a personal point of view, have you found this is something that you've you've naturally grown into? Is this something that plays into your own personal characteristics, do you think?
That you know, to see yourself moving into this sort of position. If if someone looked at your your early life, would they say this is this is the path that you they always thought you would have taken? >> Probably, yes. >> [clears throat] >> I don't see myself that way, but probably people that know me well, they will say it doesn't surprise me. I I see it differently, right? I see the journey.
And I I see the learning curve that I had to that I had to do to get here. So, it doesn't come as easy and naturally, but maybe maybe maybe >> Yeah, everything's easy in hindsight. So.
>> Yeah, when you see it from the outside, right? >> Yeah, yeah, completely. Let's talk about what it actually takes to run a practice. What are the things, you know, in your your position now, what are the things that you look at other architects, other businesses doing that maybe they're doing wrong?
>> I mean, I will probably come from my angle and I know I will be a bit biased because I that's how I basically transition my career and got where where I am, but I will say that um it's acknowledging that architecture is like a business like like any other.
>> Sure. >> I think that's what architecture businesses are not doing right. Acknowledging that without a successful, well-run business, there is no design to do. And they are both as important. So, it's not about removing the importance of design or business, it's about it's about having both at the same time and that's hard.
Because as architects, we are not trained as business people. Right? >> Completely. >> And so we are throwing to the deep end and people that open their own businesses all of a sudden need to understand a lot about and you probably you know the conversation that we having earlier but a lot about profitability and and the the time cost money and and
how to charge for projects and and what is the value that we put to our design ideas, right? And so I think having understanding and realizing that is probably the biggest mistake of I would say that that the architecture practices in general are are doing.
>> There's a very easy way for architects to say we don't enjoy that side of things, you know, we like to design things and and put your head in the sand to that side of things and and and like you allude to, you know, the business side of stuff doesn't necessarily come naturally to a lot of people.
Is it something that a decision that you had to make in your past that kind of said, I see these things as equally weighted or the sense that maybe I have to put away my pens and and pick up my spreadsheet.
You know, is that a conscious decision or is that something that evolves over time? Can we have both? >> We have to have both. But some people I I can't have both on my role, right? But my my role is about ensuring that I got both in my business.
>> In that as a business, yeah. >> And so I think both needs to exist and and it's about having the right people, the right skills in the right place. I I don't I don't point I need I had to make a decision. I remember it very well.
I was I was at a point doing both uh still running projects and and and trying to run it was it was much before I became COO. I was I was I was the commercial uh director uh of the group, but it was I couldn't do both. It was it was too much. I wasn't doing anything right. So, I said I do one or the other.
And and I could see that on that on the business side I was adding a lot of value. >> Sure. >> And there were there were a lot of other designers and and project runners and managers.
Um but there weren't that many on the other side and I could really help. >> Mhm. >> And so that's when I I remember the day I I made that decision actually. Yeah. >> Was that a scary decision to make?
>> No. It was the best decision I've ever made for me. Yeah, I I never look back. I uh um I found my my real passion. I I felt like it could really contribute and make a difference.
And um and I found it natural. It almost it it came it came natural easy, right? To me. So, no. It wasn't I was very clear >> Mhm. >> of it. Maybe not others. The the there was internally a bit of fight.
>> Sure. >> What what what what was I going to be placed? >> Mhm. >> But but for me it was it was very clear. Yeah. >> You've spoken previously about the importance of data in understanding all of this, understanding how practices work, how businesses work. Can you talk a little bit about the importance of that in your in your role?
>> I am a huge fan of data. I I I live and and breathe data. Cuz data it's power and and and and help us make better decisions.