The Orthodox Muslim · Transcript · · Updated
DEBATE: Is Jesus The Most High According To The New Testament? Godlogic VS The Orthodox Muslim – Transcript
Video by The Orthodox Muslim · Watch the original on YouTube
Summary
AI-generated from the transcript. Verify details against the source video.
- libiano states that Jesus is a lesser ontological inferior God who became a man and lacks at least one essential great making property.
- Avery reads Hebrews 1:6 to argue that the father commands all of God's angels to worship the son in virtue of who he is.
- Jesus existed before all of creation and came into existence in time by an act of will, coming forth out of the father.
Use this video with Pro
Reading, copying and transcript downloads are free. Create saved AI results for this video with a signed-in Pro account ($9/month).
Transcript
Search ignores accents. All transcript text stays visible.
what is going on everybody we are getting ready to get this thing underway thank you for everybody's patience we had to finally get you know some things in order but we got it all down packed and the debate is underway so we're gonna have libiano going first with his 15minute opening the battle is is Jesus the most high God
in the New Testament I want to thank the Orthodox Muslim for coming out I want to thank God Logic for coming out and accepting the debate and um we just don't have a good time man so what we're gonna do first is we're gonna pass the floor over to libiano and um guys I want to let you guys know this debate will also be on Spotify so if you have a Spotify account make sure you click the
link in the description follow the Spotify so you play the debate back um just in audio form we do have audio form of a lot of our debates and our conversations on our Spotify so if you want to go download that listen to some of the stuff while you're jogging or Etc that's where you go right so we are going to go ahead and get this underway I know you guys have been waiting long enough we have 1300 people in here we
should have, 1300 likes as the stream grows we want this to hit the algorithm all right this is a very important debate is Jesus the most high God in the New Testament both of these brothers have presentations to present and uh we're gonna get it underway so libiano you are gonna take the first minutes yes thank you very much for having me today
I appreciate it thank you for setting it up um thank you Avery for showing up to today's debate uh I appreciate it how do I uh start my presentation here let me just all right um is that is that good okay okay everything's
good okay perfect so is Jesus the most high God Yahweh well not according to the New Testament absolutely not um the thesis and the outline is going to be this um Jesus is a lesser ontological inferior God who became a man I'm going to argue that this is what the New Testament teaches from a new testament framework Jesus is not fully Divine and what that means is that Jesus lacks at
least one essential Divine or great making property Yahweh has essential properties if Jesus lacks at least one essential property he cannot be Yahweh the authority of Christian scriptures is going to be granted for today's debate so whatever Avery considers to be the word of God inspired 66 books 73 books whatever whatever it may be I'm going to accept it for today's debate my arguments will be based upon positive
facts from the New Testament as well as negative facts from the New Testament um and my arguments will not violate any classical any uh principles of classical logic um and so um there's a small disclaimer if it is the case that Jesus lacks a single great making property it necessarily follows that he is not numerically identical to Yahweh I want this to be very clear and I want this to be in the
back of everybody's mind I'm going to be using two guiding principles uh throughout this presentation the first one is going to be the inference to the best possible explanation it goes something like if some observation o is more likely to appear given the truth of hypothesis one over hypothesis 2 then observation o confirms hypothesis one over hypothesis 2 this sounds like a lot of word salad but I'm going to explain this in a second it's going to be
something very intuitive something we apply in our day-to-day life so you won't be confused the second principle is going to be the principle of Charity the principle of Charity is just going to be not assuming that the author of given text affirms any contradictory worldview and so we shouldn't read them in a manner that makes them affirm any contradictory worldview so I'm gonna give a scenario here for what I mean by inference to the best possible explanation say you share a a uh dorm
with your roommate or an apartment with your roommate and it's 2: a.m. you're sleeping and you hear loud snoring at night it's 2 a.m. and now this is the observation there are two hypotheses that explain the S observation hypothesis one is that your roommate is just regularly sleeping in the next room and he's snoring loudly this explains the observation the other hypothesis is that a homeless man from around the corner broke into the apartment building
broke into your apartment somehow he's sleeping in your roommate's bed and he's snoring although both of these hypotheses explain the one observation hypothesis one is going to be more likely and more expected it's expected that your roomate is sleeping in his room and he's snoring it's less likely a lot more surprising if a homeless man broke in and he's snoring and you hear
him at 2 am. and so this observation confirms hypothesis one over hypothesis two this is something very intuitive um the first observation from the New Testament you can't miss even if you have your eyes closed Jesus Walks talks behaves like someone else is the most high God is the true God so we see all over the New Testament and the
gospels Jesus prays to God he speaks of someone else as his God he he says that he's sent by God and he hears from God and he says that the father alone somebody other than him distinct from him is the true God and the only true God and we see this in First Corinthians and the confession of faith that for us there's but one God the father and the one Lord is Jesus Christ and so Avery
has an ad hoc response to this which I'm going to be expecting um an ad hoc response is an unjustified explanation that doesn't explain the contention that is made up on the spot and so it's going to sound like well he's only subordinate in rooll and not in essence Jesus is ontologically equal with God but he's just subordinate in role relationally and an example he likes to use is well
there's a human King and he has a son the human King and his son are just as human as each other they're consubstantial they share the same nature or of the same substance however the human King has authority over his son I'm going to show that this is this analogous and it doesn't work in this case why because God is essentially the highest Authority it's an essential
property meaning that God cannot lack it in any possible world in the in the human King example the human King can lack Authority and he still be human it's not an essential property of humanity to have authority and so he could have authority today he could have authority tomorrow he could have his trip from him he'll still be as human this is not analogous God is essentially the highest Authority he cannot lack the highest Authority and so even
relationally it would be a contradiction to say that God is the highest Authority yet he lacks authority in some sense uh this is very clear in the tanak psalm 10319 makes us clear that God Yahweh who rules overall in 1 Chronicles 29 we see the same thing that God Yahweh is exalted as head over all and so the argument I'm going to be using is going to be a uh a modus Tolen uh it's an inference rule by which the consequent
um of a conditional is denied and so the uh it's going to be something like if P then Q not P therefore not PE um premise number one if Jesus is Yahweh then he must have the highest Authority premise number two Jesus does not have the highest Authority conclusion Jesus is not Yahweh so this is expected if Jesus is not the most high God it's a lot more
surprising if Jesus is the most high God and he doesn't have the highest Authority and so this observation confirms hypothesis one over hypothesis 2 the observation the second observation no New Testament author qualifies that Jesus is only subordinate relationally or only as man instead they express no concern in in such a misunderstanding and so Paul he's going to say something
like um the the Christ is the head of the church and man is the head of the woman and Christ is the head of or or that God is the head of Christ period unqualified okay so he doesn't say Well only as man right this is going to be another ad hoc explanation um we see this in 1 Corinthians 11:3 when uh God is the head of Christ 1 Corinthians 3:23 that uh you are of Christ and Christ is
of God or in other translation you belong to Christ and Christ belongs to God or he's under God uh in Ephesians 1:22 Jesus Is God places all things under Jesus he doesn't essentially have them they are explained by another external to him and in 1 Corinthians 15: 27-28 uh Paul says for God has placed everything under his feet then he
expresses a concern in the exact opposite he says now when it says everything has put under him this clearly does not include the one who put everything under him and when all things have been sub subjected to him then the son himself will be made subject to him who put all things under him so instead of Paul expressing concern that Jesus um might might be understood as under God
he says no when it says that everything is under Jesus this does not include God because God is above him he does the exact opposite and so when we see the New Testament authors they express concerns of misunderstanding for less significant matters this it's ridiculous so for example you have in John Chapter 2 Jesus speaking about the temple and he says well destroy this Temple and I'll pick it raise it back up in three days and the Jews are likew what's Gody talking about it took us like however
many years to build it and so the author leaves an editorial comment he leaves a concern he says but the temple he had speaking about is his body Mark and Matthew do the same thing when Jesus says it is not what uh goes uh into the body that defiles is what comes out of the body and so they add there's a concern there that somebody might misunderstand and so they add an an editorial comment in saying this Jesus declared all foods clean another example
is when Jesus is talking about John his death and it seems as if he's saying that John will live forever and so the author expresses concerns and he says but Jesus did not say that he would not die he only said if I want him to remain alive until I return what is that to you that is expected if Jesus isn't the most high God it's a lot more surprising if
Jesus is the most high God that the New Testament authors would Express concern that he would be misunderstood as a subordinate ontologically inferior being observation three the New Testament teaches that Jesus is only due worship because of another to the glory of God the father that his obedience and suffering on the cross is what makes him worthy of worship like you can't miss this even when your eyes are closed in
Philippians 2811 uh Paul says therefore God exalted him to the highest Place talking about um after a suffering on the cross God exalted him to the highest Place gave him the name that is above name that at the above all names that at the name of Jesus every knee shall bow in heaven on Earth and under Earth and every tongue acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord to the glory of God the Father Yahweh is
not worshiped because he dies on a cross and he's exalted to a level of worship Yahweh is essentially worthy of worship we see the same exact thing in Hebrews 13 to four that he inherits a name above all names he becomes greater than the angels in Revelations 4 to5 in Revelations 4 we see that God is sitting on the throne in the courtroom and God is worshiped and the reason that he is worshiped he is worthy of worship
because it says for you gave all things there being in the very next chapter when the lamb who is slain is brought into the courtroom and he is worthy to read the Scrolls why is he worthy because the lamb was slain and he is given worship why because the lamp was slain so Yahweh receives worship because he's Yahweh it's an essential um uh property it's an essential quality that he's worthy of worship Jesus is not